Author Topic: 19th Century Manchester  (Read 2435 times)

JamesM

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19th Century Manchester
« on: 12:01:09, 27/05/17 »
Hi I am looking for information regarding an address in 19th century Manchester. One of my ancestors is listed in the 1861 census as a "Beer House Keeper" at the following address; The Royal Marine Beer House, Munday Street, Manchester.
If anyone has any knowledge or can point me in the right direction as to where there may be any info on the street or beer house I would be very grateful.
Thanks in anticipation
JamesM

Manx

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #1 on: 22:47:09, 27/05/17 »
There was a Munday Street off Long Millgate one of the oldest parts of Manchester, long gone now and there remains a Munday Street off Pollard Street Ancoats in which the old houses and mills have been demolished and recently replaced with modern appartment blocks.

Any clue to suggest which?


JamesM

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #2 on: 06:25:33, 28/05/17 »
Hi Manx Thanks for your reply. The only info I have is from the 1861 Census which, apart from Manchester, the Municipal ward and Ecclesiastical district is St .Michaels. Not knowing Manchester at all I don't know which Munday St. it could be. The beer house was number 5 Munday St.
JamesM

Manx

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #3 on: 11:54:52, 28/05/17 »
Ahh, St Michael's Ward, great. After being demolished the Munday Street off Long Millgate (Exchange Ward) was relocated to Corporation Street and ran to Beswick Row.

St Michael's being the infamous church associated with Angel Meadow.

Will search further if possible for the Beer house but the Google search for the pub database has been out of action for some time.

Manx

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #4 on: 14:08:18, 28/05/17 »
To help get your bearings -  link to a map of Munday Street off Corporation Street which was once Long Millgate.

http://pubs-of-manchester.blogspot.co.uk/2014/04/cheetham-arms-long-mill-gate.html

regards

JamesM

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #5 on: 14:27:32, 28/05/17 »
Thanks for the link, the map was very interesting to look at together with research about St.Michaels and Angel Meadows I got from the internet thanks to your excellent reply. Before the research I was imagining that as a pub / beer house owner my ancestor was perhaps a monied man but looking at the area perhaps not :-\ !
Interestingly his occupation on later documents is given a horse dealer but I would have thought there was more money in beer than in horses!
JamesM

Manx

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #6 on: 13:17:29, 29/05/17 »
Obviously JamesM your trying to get some impression of the location, this (1900) shot shows a beer house/pub on the corner of Munday Street (the three white cottages being on the other corner) the 'Crown and Cushion Inn' can just be seen on the far distant corner.
 
http://images.manchester.gov.uk/web/objects/common/webmedia.php?irn=1389&reftable=ecatalogue&refirn=23759

...another view (1890)

http://images.manchester.gov.uk/web/objects/common/webmedia.php?irn=1330&reftable=ecatalogue&refirn=67325

...and another (1903)

http://images.manchester.gov.uk/web/objects/common/webmedia.php?irn=823&reftable=ecatalogue&refirn=556

This would be the same location show for the 'Cheetham Arms'  in earlier link.

If you fancy your chances at searching try this link...
http://pubshistory.com/index.shtml

Select Lancashire, also try by owner name, also try pub name.

Hope this may be useful in your search

regards from Manx.  :)

JamesM

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #7 on: 14:31:52, 29/05/17 »
Manx, Great images, thank you. It seems that whatever city my ancestors started or ended up in the common thread was poverty, slum housing and all that goes with these. The pictures you pointed out to me could be exchanged for the many I have researched in my home town of Birmingham, both cities being so important in the technological development of manufacturing in Britain that was The Industrial Revolution.
Thanks for all your help, I'll carry on trying to find out more about The Royal Marine O0  JamesM

Jane Pallister

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #8 on: 13:30:41, 03/01/24 »
I lived in Munday Street Ancoats as a kid when my parents split up. The pub on the corner was called The Fire Brigade. At the end of the street was Butterworths Mill - which spanned a few streets - and over the road was a three storey (I think) block of flats and we knew a few old people in there. We called them the iddy biddys and one was called Dirty Dora. She had a pot Alsatian dog in the table and fed us rotten fruit. Not purposely but she was old and poor and we were grateful for free food. My name then was Jane Lustgarten. We and another family were the only ones on the street. The other houses were not lived in, possibly derelict. The Stephensons lived in the next street and the kids names were Billy, Linda and Anna.  We used to pull clothes out of the bales that came into the mill and we even broke in once and ate all the biscuits in the canteen. Probably was no more than an eating area. ‘Canteen’ might have been over describing it.  I think we went to Every Street primary school from there. And I also remember rolling drunks over in the grounds of the YMCA. They were too drunk to be let in so we rolled them over and took any money that fell out of their pockets. We had gas mantles. One fire downstairs. Cold running water. Outside toilet and no bathroom. A tin bath on a hook outside and mum would fill it and bath us all in it by the fire.  Two up and two down.  The lady next door kept going out and leaving her kids alone and we would try and feed them. I think she split from her husband but one day he or some boyfriend or bloke came back and threw all her furniture out of the front window.  There was also a fire and my mum rescued the family and was given an award by the fire brigade for her bravery. She was called Pat.

St Chads Lad

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #9 on: 15:48:01, 03/01/24 »
Great story, thanks for sharing.  :)

Jane Pallister

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #10 on: 16:24:52, 03/01/24 »
I managed to find a picture of the Fire Brigade and realised that the 'iddy biddy' flats in the background were actually five storeys high.  I am prevented from putting the link here but if you google fire brigade pub pollard street - it was on the corner of Pollard Street and Munday Street.  The link will show a pic of the pub with the flats in the background.

Parky

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #11 on: 16:32:33, 03/01/24 »
Excellent story jane ,we used to use the word “rolling” instead of the “modern” word mugging . . My aunty had a pub called the black mare in the sixties near tenaments it was a rough area but my aunty was a tough lady who took no messing about ,also the roughnecks wouldn’t **** on their own doorstep, ancoats now is another world .

Jane Pallister

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #12 on: 17:29:56, 03/01/24 »
I concur - rolling then.  Mugging now.  Although they were always asleep LOL  I am learning much about my own history as a result of finding this thread.  I realised that the large mill must have been Ancoats Mill but it was owned at some time by Butterworths - so that's what we called it.  When we moved to Aston Avenue in Fallowfield, I carried on with my lucrative 'career' as we were a good walk from Man City's old ground Maine Road.  So people would park in the avenue and we'd mind their cars.  If they didn't pay us up front or shooed us away (or worse) when we asked as they parked, they suffered a little 'damage'.  Next time they paid up.  Nice to keep their wipers and wing mirrors in good order.  We simply took the money, cleared off until match end, then stood by the cars as they returned to them and thanked them for their business. 

Parky

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #13 on: 17:35:36, 03/01/24 »
Aston ave ,a old girlfriend lived there ,Kathleen Lee

lozflan

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Re: 19th Century Manchester
« Reply #14 on: 06:23:42, 04/01/24 »
Re. Butterworths, Pollard St. pretty sure Frank [foo foo] Lamar worked there.
Politicians and nappies must be changed often,and for the same reason